Three Health Aide positions (GAMS, MH, TH) were restored to next year's budget at a cost of $145k. Twenty seven Lunch Monitor positions were restored to the budget at a cost of $217k. These are part-time, hourly employees. Ten Social Worker positions were restored at $1m. Restoring the K-2 summer school literacy program was rejected.
Were these the most effective ways to spend $1.36 million dollars? Does this spending address the district's top priorities? How will the Board measure the result of this spending?
Click through for meeting notes.
I'm shocked
Before I came to this website, I never realized that some people could have so much hate for teachers. If I was a teacher, I would be disgusted by this. Thanks to the teachers that I had as a boy, I grew into the successful man that I am today. Thanks to the teachers that my two sons and one daughter have and have had in the Newburgh school district, they are growing into successful adolescents. From reading these posts, I found it ironic that a lot of the people who have the most venom towards teachers seem to barely be able to write themselves. Maybe they're just bitter that they didn't take advantage of their own educational opportunities. I have a nice house and pay a lot of taxes, but at least I know that I'm getting my money's worth. If you have any problem, it should be with the way schools are funded, not with the teachers themselves or their middle-class salaries.
Who hates Teachers?
One poster made ridiculous and insulting comments regarding teachers and their profession. The remaining 2-3 pages include commnents from people who are asking and suggesting what can be done to reduce the cost of education given the economic problems they are having such as loss of jobs, decreased income and reduced savings. Several posts raise questions regarding the quality and effectiveness of several programs that have shown poor results.
Some have suggested a salary freeze, administartive cuts, wording in the contract, pension and health insurance contributions, reduced number of elective courses, decrease number of clubs and sports programs, and such.
Teachers or teacher supporters in return offered changes in the funding of schools.
Other than that horrible post mentioned, the rest of the posts do not provide any evidence of hate or venom toward teachers.
I guess you can't read between the lines.....n/t
.
NYS 2009 Regents Exam Results for Newburgh HS
2009 NYS Regents test results for NECSD -
Percentage of students passing with a grade of 65-100%
MathB - 32% pass - 68% FAIL
MathA - 41% pass - 59% FAIL
Integrated Algebra - 45% pass - 55% FAIL
Earth Science - 51% pass - 49% FAIL
Geometry - 60% pass - 40% FAIL
Living Environment - 61% pass - 39% FAIL
Chemistry - 63% pass - 37% FAIL
US Hstory - 78% pass - 22% FAIL
English - 81% pass - 19% FAIL
Pass / Fail Rates for students w/ disabilities
MathB - 17% pass - 83% FAIL
MathA - 19% pass - 81% FAIL
Integrated Algebra - 13% pass - 87% FAIL
Earth Science - 15% pass - 85% FAIL
Geometry - 38% pass - 62% FAIL
Living Environment - 24% pass - 76% FAIL
Chemistry - 60% pass - 40% FAIL
US Hstory - 50% pass - 50% FAIL
English - 41% pass - 59% FAIL
Student Achieivement
Poverty is the biggest factor contributing factor to student achievement. Poverty causes failing---MUCH MORE THAN TEACHER QUALITY. Look it up if you don't believe me. Now no one is saying that this lets teachers off the hook in any way, and there certainly can be bad teachers. But how can you put all the blame on all the teachers for students failing?
Wow, that's interesting.
Wow, that's interesting. Could you please provide your source for this information so that I can do the research for myself?
source for stats
This looks like 2008-2009 data, which you can get in this pdf.
You should hear my story
I currently work as the general manager of a large restaurant chain. About 10 years ago, before I got into the restaurant business, I thought I wanted to teach. I tried substituting for a few months and, let me tell you, working as a retail/restaurant manager is a breeze compared to teaching. It was hard enough for me as a substitute, and I know that substitutes don't have to deal with 80% of the stuff that regular teachers have to deal with. That's why I decided to go into the restaurant business instead... and you know what, I am making about $20,000 a year more right now than I would have been if I was teaching. I think you should give these teachers a break. I know what it's like and they really do not have it easy.
Once again apples vs oranges
There are those who can teach and those who can manage restaurants. Congratualations on your success. However, you failed to tell the whole story about why you get $20K more. There is a good chance you -
1. work weekends and nights,10-12 hrs a day, sometimes 6 days a week, 46-48 weeks a year, 230-240 days a year.
2. are responsible to manage a staff - their hours and pay, their training and skills, their hiring and firing, and all of the labor laws that apply
3. are responsible to maintain costs and raise profits on a daily, weekly and monthly basis
4. are responsible to maintain your establishment in compliance with the the laws and rules regarding health, food preperation and safety
5. are responsible for maintaining and growing customer loyalty
6. are attending training sessions on a regular basis
7. are subject to being transfered or given a change in responsibilities at will; no appeals, no due process
8. must show measurable attainment of periodic goals in order to qualify for a raise
9. are contributing more toward your health insurance and pension
10 can be fired without benefit of tenure, probably working on an "at will" basis.
Does this sound like what teachers are responsible to do year round?
Let me explain
1.As the general manager of a restaurant, I put in about 45 hours per week. I know that a teacher's official week is only about 36 hours, but I know that a lot of teachers are putting in at least 5-10 hours per week outside of the normal school day. I am lucky that I don't have to take my work home with me. In the end, our hours are basically the same.
2. I have to manage a staff- teachers manage a classroom. I would much rather manage a staff of adults than 25 young students at a time.
3. I maintain costs and profits- teachers create lessons.
4. I maintain compliance with laws in my fields- teachers maintain compliance with education laws.
5. I deal with customers- teachers deal with parents.
6. I attend training sessions- teachers attend training sessions.
7. I can be transferred within the chain (though it's very unlikely)- teachers can be transferred within their building or district.
8. I must meet goals- teachers must reach goals.
9. I contribute more towards health insurance and pension- Teachers make $20,000 a year less than me.
10. I can be fired- teachers can be fired (I've seen it happen).
I guess our jobs are pretty similiar. Take it from me, buddy, I've tried both professions and I know that teaching is definitely more difficult. If you haven't worked in both fields, you can take it from me. Really the only advantage that teachers have is that they get a few more weeks of vacation time and snow days off. Overall though, I would never trade my job for that of a teacher. Plus, teachers get all kinds of hate from people like you. At least nobody trashes my profession, even though people are paying my salary too though. I don't envy those teachers at all.
Everyone should sub
Thank you for posting this comment. If more people tried substituting I'm sure there would be a better appreciation of the skill and stamina required!
Some people need not apply
Not every job is suited for every person. Those who choose teaching or being an administrator are responsible to use those skills and stamina to produce the results they are trained and paid to attain. Otherwise, failing to produce educated students, that teacher/administraor should quit or be shown the door.
gready teachers!
All these gready teachers want to live off of us taxpayers and im sick and tired of it! All of the teachers steel my money and never do any hard work. Being a teacher is so easy! Why should I have to pay for schools especially when its so many minoritys in the schools. Im not rasist but its just not fair. I want to live in the good old america before obama. If they knew about what happened to us taxpayers, christopher columbis and george washington probably never wood have even wanted to discover america! Good thing my kids still live with there mom back in oklahoma were I grew up because newburgh schools are no good. In oklahoma the taxes are even less then new york to! I could probably be a better teacher then most of the teachers in newburgh and I never even finished high school. They know nothing exept how to steel my money! I had a good job to before I went on disability. Just to show how unfair it is I have been on disability for 7 years now and I get less raises then the lazy teachers. Teachers think they are entiteled to get a raise every singel year. Then they cry like little babys if not! Wah Wah Wah! There just crybabys that steel taxes and live off the goverment
What?
It sounds like you need to finish junior high school.And by the way, George Washington didn't discover America
Really
You have so miss spellings is amazing! It is Christoper Columbus, notice you capitalize proper names. States are also capitalized but I bet you can spell your name just fine with capitals sign for your "disability" entitlement check. Talk about lazy atleast teachers go out and earn their money so that they can put into taxes to pay for YOUR disability check. You really need spell check or a higher level of education entiteled what is that? Entitled? singel? Oh you mean single? get the put point yet? crybabys I am positive that is not even a word!
comment
Maybe if you had a decent teacher (one from Newburgh perhaps) you would be able to write clearly and correctly.
Really.......
Teachers pay taxes too, like the taxes that fund your FREE disability checks. By the way, you can type, so GET A JOB typing!
what i expectid
Thats the audasity and arrogence of you teachers. I point everything out and than you come around trying to insult me and telling me to get a job. Typical comunists. You think i should get a job just so i can pay for you lazy teachers. This is america and i shouldnt have to get a job just to pay taxes to you lazy teachers. You should get a job teachers. Besides my leg still hurts me sometimes but you still just think im some money mashine. The kids are better off with no school and Your just a bunch of dum comunist jerks.
THE TRUTH FROM A TAXPAYER
You come on here calling teachers all kinds of names and then you complain about the "audasity" and "arrogence" of teachers simply for pointing out that, despite your complaints that teachers live off of the taxpayers, you've admittedly been living off the taxpayers for the past seven years without working at all. You complain about insults while you are the one claiming that teachers don't work and calling teachers names like "jerks", "comunists", "lazy", and "dum". Your arguments against these teachers are pitiful and your blind hatred for teachers shows so clearly, as well as your obvious lack of education.
I'm sorry to hear about your injury, but I think that you are the one who has audacity to be talking like that about teachers when you are not even contributing anything to our community. You say you have kids who go to school out in Oklahoma so, therefore, you do have kids in schools. I wonder if you even pay any of the costs of raising them. You also claim that you're not "rasist" but then you complain about the number of "minoritys" in Newburgh schools. Personally, I am glad that you are not raising your own children because it would not be fair to them to receive such a poor upbringing. Hopefully they have some teachers out in Oklahoma that are as dedicated and caring as my own children's teachers here in Newburgh. In addition to be a proud and successful graduate of Newburgh schools, I am also very active in my children's education and have spent considerable time in multiple Newburgh schools over the past 10 years, since my first child began kindergarten. I see what goes on in these schools and I find it absurd that you would make such absurd false claims about these great teachers.
so obvious...
Forget for a second, content and context of the argument in hand. You guys are arguing a point to someone who PURPOSELY has made EVERY single grammatical and spelling error in the book! And you guys bought it, hook, line and sinker. Someone is just making fun of you all and you guys keep playing! Next time, ignore such obvious BS.
Go ahead and cut to the bone
Go and cut 30-40 percent of the budget from the schools if it will make everyone happy---for a while. You will save gobs of money on taxes. That's what everyone wants right? Then shortly, NECSD will be similar in quality to the Bronx, where most middle class people, who can, send their children to private/Catholic schools. But paying the tuition should be no problem for you guys since your gonna save so much on your taxes!
NYS Comptroller says it ALL - Property Taxes are out of control
Summary of Findings - http://www.osc.state.ny.us/localgov/pubs/research/propertytaxes.pdf
· Per capita property tax burdens in New York are 49 percent higher than the
national average and property taxes measured as a share of personal income are 28
percent higher.
· Local property tax levies grew by 60 percent from 1995 to 2005, more than twice
the rate of infl ation during that period (28 percent). Most of this growth occurred
in the last 5 years – when property tax levies increased by 42 percent, compared to
infl ation of 13 percent.
· Property taxes add to the overall high cost of living in downstate suburbs,
where property taxes per $1,000 of personal income average about $65 (compared
to the State median of $53), and are a major contributor
to higher housing costs.
Logic will not convince some
Logic will not convince some of you because of the emotional tie to the subject. Some of you have bought a house and lived a lifestyle that you could not afford, and now that taxes are going up along with the cost of living, you are looking for a scapegoat. Teachers are an easy target, we know where they work and who they are.
My heart goes out to homeowners who are senior citizens; they have raised their children and are on a fixed income.
Teachers should not feel guilty for the career they chose or the amount of money they earn. They did not take a vow of poverty. And, some teachers pay those same taxes. In New York, teachers must have their Masters within a few years of getting a job, and then must continue getting professional development to keep their license. Plenty of teachers work more than the time that school is in - don't assume that because you can't see what they are doing that they are not working. Some teachers even volunteer their time. Their is no cart blanche overtime for teachers. The summer pay is their checks divided up in smaller amounts so that it extends. Most teachers are taking courses in the summer or reading trade books that will help them become better. School districts, like large companies, get a discount on insurance - which by the way is similar to what other public employees get in New York. I didn't read anywhere a person saying cops, firefighters, elected officials should pay more into their health insurance. The same goes for pensions. A large part of the pension is from investments that the fund has participated in, not from taxpayers. The cost of running a school increases every year - electricity, gas, maintenance, food. Schools cannot make income. To think that taxes will not go up is naive.
If schools were funded another way - perhaps from income tax so that everyone shares the load but at not so heavy a price, the argument would change dramatically. Taxpayers parting with their hard earned money is muddying the waters.
If a child does not get an education, what are they going to do for a living as an adult? Rob, steal, sell drugs?
The state should stop wasting money in other areas and pursue taxes from unused land. The state and national government should either lift unfunded mandates or fund them.
Parents should take responsibility for their children - especiallly the ones who misbehave in school. Parents should vote on whether they want these extra programs or not. Some of these extra-curricular programs are an integral part of the child's study and are therefore needed.
School districts should be transparent and accountable - especially in terms of what is working and what is not, and increasing graduation rates
Logic is full of IT!
Hey il LOGIC - The cost of living has actually gone down! As a senior citizen I do not get an increase in social security because COLA has gone down. I expect my school and town taxes to go down as well. Your "heart" may go out to us seniors, but you are unwilling take a freeze that the Gov. has asked ALL NY STATE employees take to help seniors and ALL THE TAXPAYERS.
My three children all have college and advanced degrees - they work 10-12 hours a day, 48-50 weeks a year. They were each paid between 60-72k a year , but have had their income frozen for two years now AND pay 22-35% toward their health insurance. They each pay 30-50% toward their pensions or 401k plans. What do teacher pay? Nearly nothing, we, the taxpayers pay for that. So you work more than 5 hours and more than 180 days, so what! You picked this career, like my kids picked there's and they face the same economic pressures and job related stresses. You should do the same - with dignity rather than whinning!
I am not "naive" LOGIC. I understand schools cost money. I have paid property taxes for nearly 45 years and in all of those years I have seen taxes go up faster then our income, and now faster than our pension and savings. We have sacrificed doing with less to pay these ever rising taxes. I understand every child needs an education, but not all the administrators, not every sports program, not every course going and not all the extras I am now aware of, thanks to these posts - college credits, hundreds of electives and more and more social programs.
Unless my school tax bill comes down I will be voting NO!
Isn't anonymous posting great?
Dear Senior:
School taxes and city and town taxes are seperate things. The Gov. has asked for a salary freeze in an election year. How convenient? Where was this conversation a year ago. We are all aware, or should be, and the Gov. definitely is, of the Taylor Law. Plus other school bills will increase. A freeze will not necessarily mean that you or I will not have to pay higher school taxes, or that it will save money in the long run. It is a knee jerk reaction, a band aid.
Good for your children. I hope they are products of Newburgh. Most teachers also have advanced degrees, but could not start at 60-72k a year. Plenty of teachers work longer hours than the school day. The cost of health care rising is not teachers' fault - blame the insurance company. Teachers do pay toward their pension, and it is not fully funded by taxpayers. Everyone is responsible for their choices. I am not whinning, just explaining. All school employees should not be lumped together, and all taxpayers should not be either.
I restate my ideas for a fix. The government should fund education another way - perhaps income tax, fund or lift school mandates, close loopholes, and collect taxes on some property. Parents should take responsibility for their children's behavior (and most do) and fund/vote on those extra programs. School districts should be transparent on how the money is spent, what is and isn't working, and they should increase the graduation rate.
il LOGIC
Please
Teachers do not start between $60-72,000. As a matter of fact if you looked at the Newburgh contract teachers with a bachelors start in the high $40,000. Post truths.
Dear Poster (teacher?) - please read carefully first -
The $60-72,000 you are referring to is not about a teacher's salary. Please look above - as you will see, the previous poster wrote -"My three children all have college and advanced degrees - they work 10-12 hours a day, 48-50 weeks a year. They were each paid between 60-72k a year , but have had their income frozen for two years now AND pay 22-35% toward their health insurance. They each pay 30-50% toward their pensions or 401k plans."
This poster is writing about her children's salaries, not teachers.
Many of the posts here from teachers / teacher supporters fail to read carefully and understand the message many of these posters are expressing. They are not all anti-teacher, they are upset with rising taxes as it relates to their losses of income and savings and since this is a blog about schools they are speaking of school taxes in particular. Simply to "yell" at them or give them a "lecture' about who they should blame and expect that you still get your raises and benefits is simply disrespestful and insensitive to their situation. I hope you are more kind and caring with your students????
Teacher still wants it all despite the crisis of others
IL Logic, assuming is a teacher or such, replies simply by insisting that the struggling taxpayer continue providing all teachers with a raise while blaming the economic crisis on everyone else. This poster does not acknowledge that teacher raises, increases in health insurance and pension premiums increase taxes and as such increases costs to the struggling taxpayer. This poster also has ignored the facts of my words. So allow me to review -
My children worked UP TO 60-72K. They have HAD A PAY FREEZE FOR TWO YEARS. Teachers insist on no pay freeze.
My children PAY UP 22-35% TOWARD THEIR HEALTH INSURANCE - NSD teachers pay less than 10% with the taxpayer paying the other 90%
My children pay 30-50% TOWARD THEIR OWN PENSION/401K - The NSD teacher pays 0-5% with the taxpayer paying 95-100%
A salary freeze is not a "band-aid" it is what most businesses have done for at least two years now. It reduces cost and it helps save jobs.
My children's experience is not uncommon in the private business world. The problem with the teachers is that they live in a bubble and expect us, the taxpayers, to pay up because -that's what they are use too!
So everyone must sacrifice?
Alright we get it. Some pay more for health insurance than others. This point has been pounded in the ground. WE GET IT. However, I wonder how many complain to your police dept. because you think they should be paid less or get less benefits. Go to your local station house and complain that since crime has gone up, they are all incompetent and are wasting your tax dollars. It's the same thing as crucifying teachers when test scores dip. Or how about the fire departments. Go to your local government office and tell them they have too many workers there and they are overpaid. YOU DON'T. Because you know it is wrong to do so. But teachers....ah ha.....we can verbally trash them day and night. You don't bash cops because you know some day you may need one. Do you think all the negative talk about the schools will not have an effect on teacher dedication? Go tell your mailman he sucks and see if you continue to get regular mail service. You get picture. Teachers are human being with a finite tolerance for negitive energy directed towards them.
After reading many of these posts, it can be said that the anti-teacher compensation camp seems to be a bunch of scared individuals who over extended themselves and are really looking for a scapegoat and teachers are an easy target.
Can't control what you get...
And just like the police can't control or be held responsible if a lot of criminals decide to move to a certain town, teachers should not be punished when they get a bunch of difficult to teach, unruly children who parents treat the schools as daycare and have no concern for their child's learning or behavior.
So it's the fault of those who move in.....
Once again another pro-teacher post blaming the failures on "those people."
First, police are responsible for our safety despite who moves in...it's what they are trained and paid for! And yes, if the police can not do that properly then they are to blame for allowing the problem to grow.
If a teacher and administartion can not teach those who are "difficult to teach" then maybe it's the teacher/adminisrator who should be moving out!
Responsible
Teachers have to teach no matter who "moves in" and yes trained for teaching but that does not mean they are responsible for those who choose not to learn.
Newburgh police
So are you saying that, due to the extremely high crime rate in Newburgh, that the entire Newburgh police force deserves to be fired and/or take pay cuts?
If they fail to bring down the crime rate, YES!
it's called accountability - you don't get to keep your job just for saying "protect and serve"
You have no idea
Yes, in certain areas of the state there are more children who are less receptive to education. Newburgh is one of those areas. Why is this such a hard concept to understand? You have no idea what teaching is like or what it's all about, just that you don't want pay for it.
The discussion is about how much and how it's spent
A very arrogant position! Basically, you are demanding that the public pay the bill and stay out of your way. Where did anyone say they did not want to pay for "it" the discussion is about how much and how it is spent. Please cite those words on this blog.
I'll discuss whatever I want
This discussion is about whatever is posted not what you want. So now, you imply that the general public is more qualified than people with actual teaching degrees to run the schools? The general public is more qualified to designate how monies are spent? Better than those with years of experience in education? What other public agencies let you tell them how to do their work. No, you are arrogant and probably a control freak.
Teachers are not taxpayers
Teachers are not taxpayers too?
Teachers pay taxes just like
Teachers pay taxes just like everyone else (well... not everyone else, but a lot of people). Teachers pay the same property tax, sales tax, income tax, social security, etc... as all other taxpayers. The only difference is that people only complain about teachers getting paid for their work, but don't complain about anyone else getting paid for their work. They don't even complain when people steal from them. They don't care about government handouts to these corporate CEOs so that they can go on luxury retreats and take 7 and 8 figure bonuses. Let a teacher with a Masters Degree and 5 years experience make $60,000 though and these anti-education advocates are in an uproar.
Teachers pay taxes and expect a raise while residents suffer
Teachers are not immune from taxes and the cost of living.Tthe problem is that teachers here want to disregard the plight of their neighbors and fellow taxpayers who also have to pay taxes and squeeze them for more money while at the same time these neighbors are struggling with less income and savings. All school staff from administrators to the clerical and custodian staff need to recognize the fact that Albany is tapped out as are their neighbors. salaries and expenses need to be reduced.
You probably want to pay NOTHING
It's obvious that you are of the mindset that since you children are grown and out of the schools, then you should not have to pay anymore. Ideas like these are what fuels bad atitudes for public education
I expect costs and taxes to come down!
It isn't obvious at all - I and many taxpayers are looking for cost savings. I beleive your attitude is to ignore an intelligent, factual discussion and just blow off with some ridiculous rhetoric.
Well here is a fact
How can you expect a cost savings when the price of everything aside from teacher salaries is going up? I got news for you, even if teachers get a pay cut your taxes will STILL go up.
Taxes STILL go up because the old ideas are still in play
So long as public employees continue to beleive they are "entitled' to a raise while the rest of their neighbors have seen their incomes fall TAXES WILL STILL GO UP!
So long as public employees continue to beleive they are "entitled' to health insurance and pensions paid in large measure by taxpayers while the rest of their neighbors are contributing much more to their insurance and pensions TAXES WILL STILL GO UP!
So long as elected official continue to ignore the plight of taxpayers with less income TAXES WILL STILL GO UP!
Taxes do not just go up by themselves, they go up because public officials choose tomake them go up.
C'mon, Don't you even read
The poster above said that EVEN WITH A TEACHER PAY CUT TAXES WILL GO UP BECAUSE OF THINGS LIKE ENERGY COSTS AND BOOKS, SUPPLIES ETC. Let me repeat.....With teacher pay cut taxes have a good chance of going up anyway.....Then who are you going to complain to? The book companies? The electric companies? And by the way, you are ridiculing people who think they are entitled to health insurance? The president of the US got elected by telling everyone this EXACT FACT!
You're right...
Good point. You're right. With utilities, energy costs, insurance costs, and everything else, taxes would go up even if the teachers took a salary cut. Maybe it's not all the teachers' fault after all.
Taxpayers can control many costs, why not taxes
taxpayers can-
adjust the thermostat, insulate better and fine tune their appliances to reduce energy costs
drive less to reduce fuel costs
put their insurance policies out to bid to get better rates
shop more carefully to reduce food costs
spend less on non-essentials to put more away in savings....etc.....
Why not expect the BOE to reduce spending and costs to reduce taxes!!!!
Don't Assume
Why do you assume that they are not already doing this now?
If a teacher gets a 2-3%
If a teacher gets a 2-3% raise, that still probably doesn't even cover annual cost of living expenses. Between constant increases in food prices, gas prices, medical costs (yes... even with health insurance, medical costs keep going up), utilities, taxes (yes... teachers do pay taxes too, believe it or not), and other everyday living expesnes. I know a few teachers and they don't live like kings, they're barely getting by too. Why is it that everyone always complains about teachers' salaries, but never complain about the salaries of public employees in other fields?
Once again COLA has gone down!
Who is getting a 2-3% raise these days! TAXPAYERS are being laid off, taking cuts in pay. SENIORS have had their social security frozen this year. RETIRED taxpayers have seen their investments and savings fall and there incomes drop. AND GUESS WHAT? - They all have to deal with" increases in food prices, gas prices, medical costs (yes... even with health insurance, medical costs keep going up), utilities, taxes and other everyday living expesnes."
Why do teacher posts sound so self-serving and ignore the fact that taxpayers are facing the same problems, but do not have the option of expecting a pay raise?